Java Jo’z, the drive-thru coffee franchise, discovered how to instantly zoom to the top of the Google search engine rankings: Get into a dispute with the brother of one of the Internet’s top bloggers.

Steven Lewis posted the story of how Robert Scoble, publisher of the tech blog Scobeleizer, posted an account of his brother Ben’s dispute with Java Jo’z. The influential blogger’s single post dominated search engine rankings almost immediately, displacing any positive placement Java Jo’z may have worked to achieve.

I additionally sparked other stories across the net, including stories on Java Jo’z and Cuppy’s Coffee (with whom they share a trademark) on FranBest.com, Franchise Pick, Blue Mau Mau and many other franchise & tech blogs.

Search engine tip: Do internet checks of franchise prospect’s relatives before entering a dispute. If they have a sibling with a blog in the top 25, settle it quickly and quietly.

Related Posts:  Why Java Jo’z problems are Cuppy’s problems


54 Responses to “Java Jo’z Coffee Franchise Blogs to Top Google Position”

  1. 1 Warren Moore

    Java Joz’, Cuppy’s their both the same just a different name. Cuppy’s says no way, but you decide – Cuppy’s resides at the same address as Java Joz’, the principles involved are the same, except for Roy Snowden who co-founded Java Joz and is now being sentenced for Tax problems or some sh– as a result of Java Joz’, oh by the way Java Joz’ changed their name because of trademark infrigments with Mountain Mud who claims the Snowdens stole the name from them – thus the new name Cuppy’s. I could go on but I’m sick and tired of talking about these fricking rip offs they took 30,000 of my cash to and I’ll never see it because they want to hide behind attorneys and tax problems with the government. Java Joz’ – Cuppy’s you decide but all I know is you can put lipstick on a pig and it’s still a pig.

  2. 2 Cuppy's Coffee & More

    Official Statement from Cuppy’s Coffee & More

    In May 2006, Medina Enterprises, a Nevada based company, purchased the assets of Java Jo’z Coffee & More, LLC, and Emerald Coast Manufacturing Inc. From this transaction, the principle owner of Medina formed an association with another individual, and Cuppy’s Coffee & More, an international coffee franchise, emerged.

    Through this transaction, Cuppy’s Coffee obtained the rights to the logos, assumed the leases and acquired a majority of the equipment. A majority of the former employees of Java Jo’z were offered positions and are now employed at Cuppy’s. Java Jo’z still exists as a licensing company and is owned by Kim Snowden. Roy and Kim Snowden have no financial, operational, or legal association with Cuppy’s Coffee.

    Although Cuppy’s Coffee holds no legal obligation to provide marketing, operational, or product support to the Java Jo’z customers, Cuppy’s has chosen to offer these services to the Java Jo’z owners.

    Since August 2006, Cuppy’s Coffee has been inviting any coffee business (including Java Jo’z customers) the opportunity to convert into a Cuppy’s franchise. For conversion details please contact Rudy Harper at rudy@medinamgt.com

  3. 3 Trisha A. Paliotti

    Hi I am just adding on to this last person comment.Ease up on him? Yea milion dollar mind set, is that what you call it. I worked for a mag sales crew. World Media International Inc, Run by Roy P. Snowden and Kimberly(kim)Snowden,I traveled through your city knocking on doors. Why there is not some protection in place for these kids, more then a randaom story or Blog. This man was just convicted on 5 counts of Tax evasion and defrauding the IRS. I have a tax lean on my credit report from him not filing the taxes he said he was paying!!!! We were kids, and many lives have been Ruined by these people. Freezing cold tempertures and 12-14 hr work days….$15-$20 a day if we were lucky. Then when you don’t make the cut they drop you at a bus station, spit on you and leave eyou w/ no money no ticket, in some ghetto bus station!More, More More needs to be done about this. And it starts with the people answering the doors. Don’t or if you do tak ethat kid in your house and tell them what is really going on and get them help. These kids are used to make millions of dollars for these dirty old men and thier dirty wives. I pray for the children of these people everyday! I tell you one thing there is no Justice, for these kids.This man has also screwed a bunch of People who were investing in his Java Jo’ z (cuppy’s) Franchise, many people were milked out of 30,000 dollars or more~Any other kids out there who worked for Roy P. Snowden And Kimberly (Kim)Snowden let me know!!!!!!
    Posted by Trisha A. Paliotti at 11:39 AM

    Labels: Magzine Sales Crew

    It is always a scam with this man, any anyone affiliated with him. Lets smartin’ up people.

  4. 4 Guest

    Java Jo’z and Cuppy’s are legally two different business entities. They are run by a different COO.

    Stop being fueled by hype.

  5. 5 Paul Steinberg

    If you are owed money by a company which transfered assets to a new entity and left the old entity judgment-proof (as appears may be the case here) you should speak with an attorney in your area. As discussed in more detail in various postings on the http://www.bluemaumau.org website, this may be an instance of Fraudulent Conveyance.

    Additionally, there may be remedies under your state law, and there may have been funds which the franchisor was required to hold in escrow. Contact your state franchise regulator, a list of them can be found in the CCH Business Franchise Guide, or contact the American Franchisee Association at http://www.franchisee.org

    Just because you set up 2 legally distinct entities and then engage in an inter-corporate shuffling of assets does not mean that the Transferee entity is off the hook.

    From some of the factual allegations made on other blogs, which have not been rebutted by Cuppy’s or the law firm representing Cuppy’s, (the law firm’s letter on the topic is posted at http://www.bluemaumau.com, and raises more questions than it answers) there is a suspicious confluence of circumstantial evidence that at the very least warrants investigation and a trip to your legal counsel to see if any of your money can be recovered.

  6. 6 Sean

    Good information, Paul. One of the unfortunate things about these cases is that the prospective franchisee is hesitant to invest too much more in legal fees, and the relatively low amount does not attract too many attorneys willing to work on contingency. I guess that’s what enables companies to get away with such practices.

  7. 7 Trisha A. Paliotti

    Sean Jan 17th, 2007 at 9:13 am

    Steve: Fransynergy posted this on bluemaumau.com:
    “…I took a look at the Nevada Secretary of States website and searched out Medina Enterprises were we learn that the corporate entity was formed 12/16/2003 and is Active and in good standing. Their officers all have the last name of Morgan (Alyssa R, Christina F, and Robert C) and use the address of 2533 N. Carson St, Carson City, NV 89706. This address is also the address of their Resident Agent Laughlin International, Inc. When you view all the companies which Laughlin serves as resident agent there are MANY!!!!. When you view the records for Laughlin International, Inc. you find that a Lee Morgan held all the officer positions AND they were dissolved on 4/24/2002. However they may somehow be tied to Laughlin & Associates, Inc. at the same 2533 N. Carson address whose file date is 3/25/77 and are currently an active NV corporation with Michelle Young holding all officers positions. If you jump over to the Florida Secretary of State site and take a look at Medina Enterprises you find that they’re active as a Foreign Profit corporation (Date Filed 5/8/06) with a principle address of 348 Miracle Strip Parkway SW, BLDG D Suite 16A, FT. Walton Beach FL 32548. Robert C. Morgan listed as both Registered Agent and Officer/Director.”

    FYI TO THOSE CUPPY’S EMPLOYEE’S POSTING ON HERE.I know that fact is greater then fiction. I know how easy it is to be “brainwshed by these people. Do your selves a favor and get out now. Before he takes you with him. I could not buy my first home, due to a tax lien on mty credit report. Roy said he was payng and reporting our taxes and never did. Thats the facts about the people you are dealing woth. I am sure they were sitting over your shpulder as you wrote your wonderful review of “THIER” company. Get a clue fast.Trisha A. Paliotti

  8. 8 TRisha Paliotti

    When a thing ceases to be a subject of controversy, it ceases to be a subject of interest.

    I am so really extremly shocked to see all of the post on the matter I discussed earlier are gone. Everything I have posted on this matter has been deleted. Someone tell me there has got to be something I can do about this. Cuppy’s is/ has to be breaking some law by deleting these post and redirecting URL’s. I fully plan to look into this, I spoke to the IT guy At work today and he says it is a break of federal law. That these people seem to just be getting themselves into more trouble. This really has my attention now. And anyone interested in free speach or even the gift we have been given to blog our thoughts and opinions should be deeply concerned by this company’s obviouse attempt at silencing it’s criticts. I can not believe that any lawyer representing this company would give them this advice. I know one thing I am not Scoble , I will set up a 1000 different blogs and let them delete them so that I can sue. Not for money but principal. How dare they think they have some power over the internet.

  9. 9 Robyn & Corey Rivera

    OMG!!!!
    I am blown away by the stuff I have been reading. This was all brought to my attention by a freind who said we should these blogs. My husband and I have “invested” 30k into this company with grand hopes of opening a Java Joz’s NOT Cuppies. Yes, they are the same Co. b/c when Cuppies “purchased” Java Joz’s we were told we could stay Java Joz’s with support from Cuppies. Long story short, we have been trying to aquire prperty for the building and a year and a half later we still have not opened. I contacted the Co. last week and told them we were finished (reason being: the building only appraises for 42k not the 168k or whatever the price is now, bank won’t loan money on that kind of neg. equity….)the contact person s reply to me was “Mrs Rivera this is a corperation we have bills to pay, your money is not here anymore, do you think it is kept in the office?” Well of course I do, DOES SHE THINK I AM A FRICKN IDOIT???? Calls,after calls, after calls have gotten me no wear. Morg, the guy we talked to when we handed over the money, seems to be in a meeting that lasts day and night 24/7. He is not so quick to return calls now. Everybody else in the free world at the main office has tried to talk to us getting us to let them help us, the only help we want is a 30k dollar check THAT WON’T BOOUNCE. This is coming to a head I feel a class action suit coming on. I am talking to a laywer and report this company to any organization I can. They need to be stopped. I only live 5 hours from Destin Florida I will picket this place and warn every person I can about the practices of this Tax evading, money stealing company.

    More to come???
    Robyn and Corey Rivera

    any other pepole taken?? contact me gourmet.grind@yaghoo.com

  10. 10 Sonya Muller

    To all disgruntled Java Jo’z AND Cuppy’s owners:
    I have been reading many postings and find that many of us are in the same situation (wanting out and away from this company/companies once and for all). I would like to share FACTUAL information in this posting, not opinion.
    I have retained an EXCELLENT franchise specialist attorney who is negotiating a refund of my deposit for two Java Jo’z stores. His details follow should anyone wish to contact him directly:

    Robert M. Einhorn
    Zarco, Einhorn Salkowski & Brito, P.A.
    100 SE 2nd St. 27th Floor
    Miami, Florida 33131
    Tel: (305) 374-5418
    Fax: (305) 374-5428
    E-mail: reinhorn@zarcolaw.com
    http://www.zarcolaw.com

    Mr. Einhorn was promised a response from the company’s attorney on his (my) demand for a refund this past Friday. No response has been given. As a result, I am now discussing the possibility of filing a class or group lawsuit against the company. I have already spoken with many of you about this subject. However, I do not wish to leave anyone out should this litigation come to fruition. If anyone is interested in joining me, please contact me at twosisterscoffee@aol.com. I do not wish to publish my telephone number on this forum, but many of you already know how to reach me.

    Thank you.
    Sonya Muller

  11. 11 Robyn And Corey Rivera

    Reposting my email b/c the 3am post earlier had some typo’s. I see there are others out there. Keep in touch. This thing is getting interesting. My time line of how my events unfolded will be posted (when done).

  12. 12 Robyn And Corey Rivera

    gourmetgrind@yahoo.com correct e-mail for Robyn and Corey Rivera

  13. 13 Sonya Muller

    I wish to retract my previous statement. I am aware that Java Jo’z and Cuppy’s are not the same company, and I did not intend to imply that they were. I have resolved my specific issues with Java Jo’z. As far as I am aware, there is no pending or planned class action suit against Cuppy’s or Java Jo’z. I suggest that if anyone has any problems, issues or questions regarding Java Jo’z, contact attorney David McGee at (850) 432-2415. For problems, issues or questions with Cuppy’s, contact Doug Hibbing, President of Cuppy’s, at (888) 241-4324 or Doug@Cuppys.com.
    Sonya Muller

  14. 14 Sonya Muller

    Please note that my posting of 2/21/07 contained a typographical error:

    The correct telephone number for David McGee is (850) 432-2451.

  15. 15 Carmelo Mangindin

    My wife and I bought in for 20k in 2003. I could not get a loan, or a lease. I am in the Marine Corps and could not invest all the time needed to make this dream come through. I am currently deployed to Iraq for a year and now wonder if this business venture was a mistake. I would like to get my money back. What do I have to do?

  16. 16 Sean

    Carmelo:

    First, we’d like to thank you for your service in Iraq, and extend our best wishes for a safe return.

    I’m sorry you were unable to secure a loan or lease. As you’ve no doubt read, Java Jo’z founder Roy Snowden is facing serious fraud and tax evasion charges and may be going away to Club Fed for up to 30 years. The assets of Java Jo’z were sold to the company now operating as Cuppy’s Coffee & More.

    Sonya Miller, who is in somewhat the same boat, suggests you contact attorney David McGee at (850) 432-2451. She also suggested contacting Doug Hibbing, President of Cuppy’s, at (888) 241-4324 or Doug@Cuppys.com.

    Here’s another attorney familiar with the situation:

    Robert M. Einhorn
    Zarco, Einhorn Salkowski & Brito, P.A.
    100 SE 2nd St. 27th Floor
    Miami, Florida 33131
    Tel: (305) 374-5418
    Fax: (305) 374-5428
    E-mail: reinhorn@zarcolaw.com
    http://www.zarcolaw.com

    Some others in your situation who have posted email addresses include Robyn and Corey Rivera at gourmetgrind@yahoo.com, and Sonya Miller at twosisterscoffee@aol.com.

    Others have left comments on Java Jo’z and Cuppy’s at http://www.franchisepick.com and http://www.franbest.com and http://www.bluemaumau.org.

    Best of luck with your situation. I have heard that Cuppy’s is helping people recover their money from Java Jo’z deposits; I’d love to post a success story to that effect. Let us know how it all comes out.

    Sean

  17. 17 Christy Wells

    I signed on with Java Joz back in June 06 with a very large down payment. I was told that they have “in house” finance personnel of which one of them specializes with SBA loans (you know how bad the paperwork can be with them). So I was so happy that they would help me from beginning to end!! After I sent in my money and contract, it took awhile for anyone to call me so I had to call them to find out how to move this process along. Our first loan, we weren’t qualified. So then the run-around. Different people to speak with, no calls returned (this happens often!). To make a long story short, my husband and I decide that we didn’t want to put any more money into this company because if they are messing around with our financing, what will they do when we have the business? These are NOT people that I want to deal with!! So, as soon as I let them know that I want out? OH, now they say that they found a lender who has “pre approved” us and if we don’t go forward with them then Cuppies can say that we turned down financing. I stated that I wanted my money back ($33,000.00 by-the-way) and know what they said?? It has to go to Dan Jones for review of my contract and that it will take two weeks and not to call before then because he might not have it done. What is he going to do? Take my contract, look it over with a fine tooth comb to see what monies can be legally taken from me?? Is that it?? (As I was told, real estate fees, due-diligence) WHAT FEES??? YOU DIDN’T DO A DAMM THING EXCEPT MAKE INTEREST OFF OF MY MONEY!! So, now, I’m in the “two week” waiting period.

    Cuppies, if you want to make things right you would return the money owed, in full, to me and others who have invested in their dream that want out!!

    If you are thinking about doing business with this company, email me at hgpchristy@yahoo.com and maybe we can do something about it!!

    Christy Wells
    NC

  18. 18 guest

    Well well well Trisha, TC, you are so full of it. Never on the sales crew were you told your taxes would be filed for you. That was YOUR job – too bad you were too crooked to remember. You were a cheat and a troublemaker. You didn’t know how good you had it. Many many people did/do. And very successful because of all the great qualities Roy stood for. Your lying ways got you what you deserve.

  19. 19 Sean

    guest:

    You said that Roy Snowden created a good situation for many people and made them “very successful because of all the great qualities Roy stood for.”

    Which qualities, exactly, would those be? The fraud or the tax evasion?

    I’m sure Mr. Snowden will be an inspiration to his entire cell block!

  20. 20 Trisha Paliotti

    YEa..great qualities ROY….how is your daughters gonna feel on x-mas visiting the Pen…We were forced into scituations where we needed to do certian things…I was offered to come back only after i asked for my w-2′s…hmmm wonder why….ROY and KIm are tax evading…..selfish….scum….MAG SLIME…

    Hey enjoy the hard boiled eggs….And Don;t drop the soap!!!!

  21. 21 Christy

    I have spoken with Mr Dan Jones for the first time and I must say that he is very willing to help me with either the franchise or a refund. I do know that Cuppies staff is VERY friendly and that they are VERY willing to help anyone willing to start a business. Last year was a very turbulent year for the change over and I, unfortunately, was smack in the middle of the change for Java Joz to Cuppies. If you EVER need help with any area of the process, I suggest that you call Dan Jones at Cuppies and he should get you movin’ along!

  22. 22 Trisha Paliotti

    NORTHWEST FLORIDA BUSINESSMAN SENTENCED TO
    FOUR YEARS IN FEDERAL PRISON FOR TAX FRAUD

    Pensacola, Florida – Gregory R. Miller, United States Attorney for the Northern District of Florida, announced that Roy P. Snowden was sentenced today on conviction for five counts of Evasion of Payment of Income Taxes and one count of Conspiracy to Defraud the Internal Revenue Service (IRS).

    Snowden admitted during his November 2006 plea hearing that he was a businessman engaged in a variety of marketing and investment-type ventures, including a magazine distribution business. He had most recently been manufacturing and selling “Java Jo’z” drive-thru coffee businesses. The indictment and factual basis for pleas further proved that his wife was named president and director of the Ft. Walton Beach business, though the indictment alleges she had little to do with its operation.

    Snowden admitted that he failed to file accurate and timely income tax returns from 1992 through 1997, and was subsequently assessed taxes by the IRS. After the tax assessment, Snowden admitted he transferred businesses and placed assets in others’ names, and created corporate entities which he used in part to transfer and hold money and property out of the reach of the IRS.

    Senior United States District Judge Lacey A. Collier sentenced Snowden to 48 months (four years) imprisonment, to be followed by three years of supervised release, and to pay a special monetary assessment of $100 per count of conviction. Judge Collier further ordered Snowden to pay $1.16 million restitution to the IRS. To date, Snowden has already paid over $900,000 of that restitution to the IRS.

    The investigation was conducted by IRS Criminal Investigation. The case was prosecuted by Assistant U.S. Attorney Michelle M. Heldmyer

    Pots calling Kettles Black…HMMM…..

  23. 23 Sean

    Christy:
    I hope that Dan Wells follows through and proves worthy of your trust. Please report back with the good news. Best of luck.

  24. 24 guest

    I am glad that Danny Jones is getting your money back. We can see by Christy and Sonya that if you retract your statements you stand a good chance of getting help. Keep those refunds going Dan.

  25. 25 Sean

    guest:

    You say: “keep those refunds going Dan.” No one has reported that they have actually received refunds. Have they? As you must be a company representative, why not share the success stories of those who have received their money back? Is Danny Jones, as you say, getting their money back?

    Have Christy or Sonya received refunds, or have they simply agreed to retract their statements in the HOPE of getting money back – or fear of repercussions?

    guest: Why the anonymity? Why do Java Jo’z/Cuppy’s representatives hide their identities? Honest, open dialogue, as Sanderson said, dispels suspicion. We’d love to share the success stories of those you’ve assisted instead of just seeing detractors disappear after their hopeful retractions.

  26. 26 Guest

    I most certainly am NOT a Java Jo’z/Cuppy’s company representative. My response above regarding return of customers’ money was meant to be sarcastic. Take it from someone who knows first hand, neither of these companies (although they really are one in the same) really wants to “help” their licensees and/or franchisees except to “help themselves” to the customer’s money. I have been the one person that has truly helped certain individuals get their money back by sharing with them certain documents that can arm them with inside knowledge about the way Java Jo’z/Cuppy’s truly operates.

  27. 27 Sean

    Guest:

    Sorry I missed that you were being sarcastic. The company obviously visits these posts and reads the comments, but never joins the dialogue… so actually I was surprised. The pattern seems to be that someone makes an angry or desperate post sharing their experience and the amount of money they are trying to recoup from Cuppy’s/Java Jo’z, then posts a follow-up retraction (seemingly as part of some agreement) then is not heard from again. I sincerely hope that it’s because they are getting some or all of their money back… If so, the company deserves some credit. I’m eager to report a happy ending or two.

    The dilemma is… where does that money come from? From Roy Snowden’s liquidation? From the sale of his $2,000,000 home? One would hope the government would use those assets to repay the individuals whose money was used to purchase such extravagences. Or would it come from Cuppy’s, the current entity? Hopefully not from the deposits of new and future franchisees signing on…

    Does anyone know if new Cuppy’s owners are required to put down a deposit before they have found a location or secured financing?

  28. 28 Guest

    Yes, they are required to put down a deposit. What everyone is failing to realize here is it’s the same company, headed by the same individuals, running the same “game”. Only Roy Snowden is out of the picture, but I say, “buyer beware” to all potential licensees and/or franchisees as all the parties involved with Roy back in the Java Jo’z days are now with Cuppy’s!

  29. 29 Trisha A. Paliotti

    Sean:

    I Am very impressed in your due Diligence on this matter….I think it is obvious that most of this is just a plot to keepp Snowden names out of this ….and I am also sure there is some account some where w/ his name on it.

    After his term is up he will be living “JUST FINE’.
    Just my opinion, but a valid one.

    Trisha

  30. 30 Trisha A. Paliotti

    Oh and FYI , no need to go into to detail….

    Guest Wrote:
    Well well well Trisha, TC, you are so full of it. Never on the sales crew were you told your taxes would be filed for you. That was YOUR job – too bad you were too crooked to remember. You were a cheat and a troublemaker. You didn’t know how good you had it. Many many people did/do. And very successful because of all the great qualities Roy stood for. Your lying ways got you what you deserve.

    Never knew how good I had it….Roy keeeping my money….living on 10 dollars a day 5 kids to a slimly hotel room….sex grugs and thievery everywhere….peole insulting kids intelligence, and 12-14 hour work days in heat , snow , rain , freezing temps…Kids being demoralized….Yup…life I always dreamed for myself….What was I thinking….Thanks for bringing me back to reality of “HOW GOOD I HAD IT”

    HA!

  31. 31 Christy

    I just wanted to let you know that I haven’t received my refund yet. I will keep you posted.

  32. 32 Robyn

    I have posted blogs since Feb of 07, Long story short we are out $30k. We hired Bob Einhorn out of Miami in March. We have not gotten anything yet. I have found others right there in florida whom we met in “coffee college” @ Cuppy’s who after 2 years are just 3 days open. The building I was told by this owner is wired wrong, plumbing is wrong, and some of the equipment is used. TWO YEARS, what is up with that? My calls went unanswered until I started raising hell then I started getting calls from them saying I needed to get in touch with them asap, it is very important. to late, its only important when to much noise is being made. Christy I hope you get your money back as I hope others do. Why people are not speaking out is a good question. I know for a fact Cuppy’s looks at these sights makes you ask yourself, WHY!!! what are they scared of? If they were on the up and up they would not have to worry about what their victims are saying about them. I am grateful in a way, I only lost $30k, others have lost 100′s. Both sums are a hard pill to swallow and I will not let my pill go done easy. I warn everyone and tell anyone about what happend to me and my husband. My town is large enough to hold two maybe three of these drive through shops and I tell everyone I meet how my money was stolen. This town is not to big that word doesn’t get around. Even if I don’t get my money back I hope my story will prevent other people from donating their money to Cuppy’s / Java Jo’z foundation for theives.

  33. 33 Mike

    Hi Robyn and Christy. I too was ripped off and lied to by Java Jo’z/Cuppy’s. I am in the process of writing letters to the FTC and the Attorney General in TX and FL. I also have an attorney who has spoken with about 5 other owners/victims. If you would like to speak with me regarding this issue and how we, and others, may be able to come together to make these crooks and liars accountable, please contact me at cuppajoe@threelumpscoffee.com.

    Mike

  34. 34 Robyn

    This is enough!! This company needs to be stopped. It makes me sick to see more people each time I come to these sights. If you are a victim of Java Jo’z contact me at gourmetgrind@yahoo.com we need to come together. One voice is barely heard hundreds of voices gets us noticed.

  35. 35 Sean

    Concerned:
    Your petty and ill-conceived post makes ME concerned. You obviously have little regard for these victims or you would provide a factual, credible warning instead of engaging in anonymous character assassination obviously motivated by a personal grudge. I don’t know these lawyers and I don’t know you, but your post makes you sound like a sore loser, a whiner and a coward. Your scatalogical references, insults about height, appearance and office tidiness, your effete attitude toward state schools and Harvard’s undergrad program, your unwillingness to even fake credibility (“Without knowing the details, I suspect you will lose your case.” “Don’t ask me how I know.”), and your low-blow innuendos say more about you than Einhorn & Zarco. Most significantly, your use of “Tee hee hee!” completely blows any shred of credibility you may have had.

    I have to thank you, however, for the two professional scenarios you provided. The first: A lawyer (who only went to Harvard as an undergrad!) is denied a McDonald’s franchise and goes on a life-long professional vendetta against all franchisors. The second: A diminutive man is unable to attain his dream of becoming a certified public account, so must instead accept the demeaning fate of being a partner in a successful law firm. Can I submit this as a TV series to David E. Kelley? As soon as I stop laughing, I mean.

    Two serious points here: The anonymous personal attacks and innuendo of your post jeopardize my ability (or willingness) to allow an open forum for discussion and information. Do you think I don’t receive pressure and threats from the companies who are discussed here? If I’ve got to deal with freaking morons trying to disrupt a lawyer’s marriage because he kicked their ass in court, or because he told them their stupid invention was a loser, then I’ll do something more productive, like clean my garage.

    The second point is that people are posting here because they got scammed, are trying not to let it happen again and need help. If they’ve got reason not to trust these guys, give them something concrete to go on and suggest an alternative. I posted their info. I wouldn’t do that if you gave me a credible reason not to. Instead, you’ve raised their stature in my eyes. I didn’t know he studied Economics at Harvard AND is a snappy dancer. Being hated by Dade County – Home of Anita Bryant and dimpled chads – is another plus. And I figure anyone who can piss off an adversary as much as they’ve pissed you off can’t be all bad.

    Now that we’ve traded clever insults: Who SHOULD these people contact for help with their situation?

  36. 36 Robyn Rivera

    I’ll follow your advice, followed by research, Sean. Thank you for your HELP!!!

  37. 37 Paul Steinberg

    For those interested in the post-mortem, see my article on bluemaumau.org which also has the link to the new article by Julie Bennett in Franchise Times.

  38. 38 Sean

    Definitely check out Paul’s article as well as the posts at http://www.franchisepick.com:

    http://www.franchisepick.com/category/java-jozcuppys/

    Lots of valuable franchise marketing and media relations lessons to be gleaned from this mishandled situation.

  39. 39 Erin Johnson

    I was screwed by Cuppies and need to get my money back. Please contact me so that we can file a lawsuit. 661-406-7809
    btrlife07@yahoo.com

  40. 40 Greg

    It is clear that some people have writen checks for $30K without reading a contract. We read it and realized that the money was NON-REFUNDABLE. It has been a struggle to open our drive-through, but we were not naive enough to think it would be easy or free. I feel bad for those folks who put their hard-earned money down based on some unrealistic dream and some carefully crafted words of a sales rep, but that does not make the company bad. There are a variety of issues that I have with this fledgling company, but I also have investigated many franchises and the reason many of us chose Java Joz was because it is CHEAP to buy in compared to most. Many people wanted to get rich and saw this as an opportunity without risk. There is no such thing and we knew there was risk when we paid our money. Instead of giving up when confronted with setbacks and roadblocks, we persevered as any succesful small buisinessman must. While sometimes slow, the team at Cuppies and JJ’s has come through on most promises. Instead of giving up and begging for our money back, we pushed through and now face the even more daunting task of running a business and trying to remain profitable. Without intestinal fortitude and a substantial financial reserve, we would be “out” our money too. Those without both of these attributes will not succeed at any franchise regardless of the amount of the non-refundable deposit.

    Another clear problem with the people that want their money back is that they cannot get financing or find a lease. Niether of these issues is caused by JJ’s, so how is it that they are being held responsible for a refund to someone for that person’s lack of business wherewithal? The observable goal of this company has been to get us financing, location, a building, product, and training so that we could open a store and begin operating. This required some input from us, but there was never any hint that they were uncooperative in getting us going. To the contrary, they were enthusiastic and helpful, if slow and disorganized. Now that we are open, the struggles of getting up at 3:30am, maintaining stock, marketing our store, attracting and keeping reliable staff, worrying 24/7, spending our savings while we strive for a real profit, and all of the other things that go with running a business help us realize that this is the hardest part of the transaction. If we had first to create a logo, design a building, find a contractor, create and buy colateral material, build an employee manual, and do all the thousands of things that JJ’s has already done and was willing to share with us for a $1 annual fee, we would still not be open. this company provided a huge headstart for us for a very reasonable fee.

    Many of the arguments and complaints about JJ’s revolve around ignorance regarding the relationship. We are not franchisees, we are liscensees. There is a huge difference in meaning and in monetary terms. For example, we do not pay any royalties to JJ’s. This means that the compny will not partake in any of our revenue, large or small. For a company to continue to support our endeavors with no royalties shows good faith. Further, as liscencees, we all enjoy a great amount of independance as to how we run our businesses and what products we decide to sell. Niether of these freedoms exsist in a franchise relationship.

    Like any purchase, one should consider carefully the positives and negatives that may be inherent in the transaction. Certainly, one should always read and understand all contracts before signing. One should also asses the financial risk involved in any investment of this magnitude. Investing $30K without the ability to get the additional $250K required to open and operate is a poor personal and business decision; however, it is one that is the responsibility of the individuals making it, not the company making the offer.

    I am not an representative of the company, nor do I have a relative that is. I am just a guy that does not like to see people avoid responsibility for their poor decisions, especially when I made the same decision work. “What one can do, all can do”

  41. 41 Sean

    Greg said: It is clear that some people have writen checks for $30K without reading a contract. We read it and realized that the money was NON-REFUNDABLE… we were not naive enough to think it would be easy or free. I feel bad for those folks who put their hard-earned money down based on some unrealistic dream and some carefully crafted words of a sales rep, but that does not make the company bad.

    Greg: Keep in mind that you are commenting on a year-old post and therefore may be comparing their apples to your oranges. The people commenting here signed a contract issued by Roy Snowden, the pre-Cuppy’s founder, that stated that the fees WERE refundable if the franchisee failed to secure a suitable location in one year. That the fees were refundable was not disputed… but by that time Snowden was on trial for fraud and their fees were spent… possibly furnishing his $2M house.

    Greg said: Many people wanted to get rich and saw this as an opportunity without risk. There is no such thing and we knew there was risk when we paid our money.
    Again, you are judging others without knowing the facts. No one saw this as an opportunity without risk. They gave $30K after signing a refundable agreement. They came back after not finding a location to find that Snowden could not keep up his contractual obligation and was going to prison for fraud.

    Greg said: Instead of giving up and begging for our money back, we pushed through and now face the even more daunting task of running a business and trying to remain profitable. Without intestinal fortitude and a substantial financial reserve, we would be “out” our money too. Those without both of these attributes will not succeed at any franchise regardless of the amount of the non-refundable deposit.
    I applaud your intestinal fortitude and your confidence that there is no business obstacle that a superior man cannot overcome through discipline and perseverence. Where is your location? Please share your success story and pics and we will post here and/or on http://www.FranchisePick.com. You can email pictures of your unit, grand opening, and info to me at info[at]ideafarm.net.

    Again, the early JJ contracts with Snowden were refundable.

    Greg said: Another clear problem with the people that want their money back is that they cannot get financing or find a lease. Niether of these issues is caused by JJ’s, so how is it that they are being held responsible for a refund to someone for that person’s lack of business wherewithal?
    Greg: You’re correct. Not being able to find a site or obtain financing is not the franchisor’s – or licensor’s – fault. But why would they be entitled to keep a fee that they did not earn? That’s not a legit business arrangement. Ask the hundreds of Quiznos franchisees who were sold agreements for territories the company (allegedly) knew no sites would be available within. How did they know? Because they racked up millions of fees from all the others who had put nonrefundable deposits down on the same saturated territory.

    I worked with a truckstop franchise with a $10M investment level and a $50K franchise fee. They charged a $5K site assessment fee to cover their extensive efforts and time checking out a territory and site. If it didn’t work out, they kept $5K, not the total $50K fee. Why would they?

    Greg said: I am just a guy that does not like to see people avoid responsibility for their poor decisions, especially when I made the same decision work…
    Congratulations on opening your franchise. I wish you the best of luck. You sound young and like a first-time business owner. It’s great that you take responsibility for your own success – critical, actually. A couple of constructive suggestions would be to hold off using yourself as a success story until you have recouped your investment and maintained solid profitability, and hold off judging others – especially when you don’t have your facts straight. Business ownership has a way of bestowing the gift of humility upon those who seem to need it most.

  42. 42 Robyn & Corey

    Greg,
    Let me thank you for your nieve veiw of my ablitiy to open, own and opperate a business. I should have consulted you before trying to open a thrid business. Yes you see my husband and I have successfully planed, designed, opened, and run coffee shops for 6 years now. Our choice to invest in a Java Joz was after much consideration and careful planning. Our money problems were not problems at all, you see funding was NEVER the problem finding suitable land at a resonable price however was. We tried for over a year to aquire property that was suitable for a drive thru business after all you would not invest in a location without the possablity of great returns. Sure we could have put it in another area but after all any GOOD business minded person would know it is all about location location location, but I guess our college degrees did not teach us that. Yes we could have used thier leasing dept but did you know they charge you $25k (at that time) for this service which is then sold to a third party (low and behold) your paying double for a lease that is not worth it, but I am sure you knew that. Thank you so very much for your uneducated veiw on HUNDREDS of peoples niave, get rich, easy as pie, unrealistic dream of owning a business (or another business). I am sure with veiws like this you will make it far in life.

    Robyn & Corey

  43. 43 guest

    I have been following the Cuppy’s scam for some time through a relatives nightmare with this company. I see that there haven’t been many posts here in a while….maybe because there are too many dead bodies in it’s wake. Morg (Robert C Morgan) and his hencemen are nothing but con artists…..snake oil salesmen out for their own egotistical satisfaction. Morg and co got off easy with cushy settlement to walk away. Keep an eye out franchise bloggers, he’s scheming as we type to find the next set of victims to suck the life out of. These people are not out to help anyone but them selves. Look at their track record. It’s like an empty pasture full of cow manure. Robert C Morgan is the kiss of death to anything he touches.
    Buyer beware!

    Good luck to the new owner. For the sake of those that have lost thousands, I hope they offer them help and relief.
    In my opinion, new branding and a fresh name would be the best move all around. Cuppy’s name has been poisoned beyond repair.

  44. 44 Sean

    guest wrote: I see that there haven’t been many posts here in a while….maybe because there are too many dead bodies in it’s wake. Morg (Robert C Morgan) and his hencemen are nothing but con artists…

    Can’t argue with you there, guest. However, there are lots of comments and discussion at http://www.franchisepick.com and at http://www.unhappyfranchisee.com

  45. 45 Christy Shaw

    Hi,
    I gave $35,000 3/06 and have been hoping that I would be taken seriously instead I’ve just been taken for a very long expensive ride. I sent another $45,000.00 via SBA loan to get my building in April .08, now its July and for some reason, I have no building comming and no responce other than were working on it. They took my money and all I have is another expensive recourse of mediation, you know what that will get me! I wish I could strip them of their life savings, like they have of mine. P.S. all Cuppies people that think that Java Joz people are a bunch of whiners, I’m pretty sure many of you will be expieriencing the same, and I wouldn’t wish that on anyone.
    Good luck to you all!

  46. 46 David Buchite

    Christy, I can help you collect the money that is rightfully owed to you from those deadbeats at Cuppy’s Coffee!!!

  47. 47 B. Hoo

    look who’s up to no good again

    Plaintiffs: ROY P. SNOWDEN and KIMBERLY M. SNOWDEN
    Defendants: JOHNSON & JOHNSON, ORTHO-MCNEIL PHARMACEUTICAL, INC. and JOHNSON & JOHNSON PHARMACEUTICAL RESEARCH AND DEVELOPMENT, LLC

    Case Number: 3:2010cv03510
    Filed: July 8, 2010

    Nature of Suit: Torts – Injury – Personal Injury- Product Liability
    Cause: 28:1332

  48. 48 B.hoo

    Roy Snowden is back in court, this time as a plaintiff.

    SNOWDEN et al v. JOHNSON & JOHNSON et al
    Plaintiffs: ROY P. SNOWDEN and KIMBERLY M. SNOWDEN
    Defendants: JOHNSON & JOHNSON, ORTHO-MCNEIL PHARMACEUTICAL, INC. and JOHNSON & JOHNSON PHARMACEUTICAL RESEARCH AND DEVELOPMENT, LLC

    Case Number: 3:2010cv03510
    Filed: July 8, 2010

    Court: New Jersey District Court
    Office: Trenton Office [ Court Info ]
    County: Middlesex
    Presiding Judge: Joel A. Pisano
    Referring Judge: Tonianne J. Bongiovanni

    Nature of Suit: Torts – Injury – Personal Injury- Product Liability
    Cause: 28:1332
    Jurisdiction: Diversity
    Jury Demanded By: Plaintiff

    Roy was actually the Grandaddy of the Cuppy’s debacle, as he was the founder of predecessor Java Jo’z.
    Roy Snowden’s house is now valued by Zillow at $847,000, a drop of $1.5M from the asking price 2 years earlier. Actually, Zillow put the value at $1.5M 2 yrs ago.

    http://www.zillow.com/homedetails/2026-Pritchard-Point-Dr-Navarre-FL-32566/47893855_zpid/

    Roy Snowden is still a guest at Club Fed in Orlando and will be until 10-22-10 for tax fraud.

    ROY P SNOWDEN
    57-White-M
    06456-017
    ORLANDO CCM

  49. 49 Ryan Bryce

    @ Christy Shaw! Admit it you have been had. This is the world’s oldest scam to tell a person that he or she can recover the money by pouring in some more. You went for it hook, line and sinker. My sympathies are with you.

  1. 1 the Franchise Pundit
  2. 2 Franchise Pick - The Death of the Blogosphere OR Who’s Killing the Cuppy’s Java Jo’z Blog Dialogue?
  3. 3 Dozens of Lives Ruined by Cleaning Franchise Scam
  4. 4 Dozens of Lives Ruined by Cleaning Franchise Scam at PIGASYS
  5. 5 Cuppy’s Coffee Originally posted on FranchisorMarketing.Com | Unhappy Franchisee

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